Author:
Moose&Squirell

Subject:
KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Those Dum Dems are sooooo paranoid about any Republican success it's pathetic!

Say and Bunda are so transparent about their true intentions. All that "dem babble" sounds like a joke! "Very concerned" my As--phalt!

KITV's only interest here is to report back to its audience, what is going on in Japan in regards to this Hawaii state tourism campaign. Hello!

KITV=1 DEMS=0

Posted on 10/07/03 3:24:16 PM

Author:
LikaNui

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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>> Say and Bunda are so transparent about their true intentions. All that "dem babble" sounds like a joke! <<

My sentiments *exactly*!
(Nice to see some action here on the message board again! THought everyone was on vacation...)

Posted on 11/07/03 08:27:38 AM

Author:
mel

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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The Democrats will use any opportunity to criticize the Governor. I am sure they will bring questions up regarding the funding for KITV at today's Tourism committee hearing at the State Legislature, despite the fact that KITV already said they will reimburse the HVCB their $4,100.



Posted on 11/07/03 10:51:39 AM

Author:
Doctah

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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You guys are missing the larger point though: Why would KITV ever agree to this in the first place? The station must have had a real momentary lapse of judgement: OF COURSE this is going to look bad! It's Journalism 101: You don't accept this kind of assistance from an organization you're supposed to be covering. It truly is a slippery slope.

Posted on 14/07/03 08:54:05 AM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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At 09:51:39 AM 11/07/03, Doctah wrote:
...You don't accept this kind of assistance from an organization you're supposed to be covering. It truly is a slippery slope.



Yes you can ...when the coverage is for the common good!


Posted on 15/07/03 00:16:37 AM

Author:
mel

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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You don't accept this kind of assistance from an organization you're supposed to be covering.

I couldn't agree more. On Friday and Monday, the Joint House and Senate Tourism committees grilled the Lingle administration, the HVCB and the HTA for using state funds to pay for KITV's reporter and cameraman's plane fare. This is despite the fact that KITV has already indicated that they will pay the $4100 in question back.

Questions of impropriety and ethics were among those that came up at the hearing regarding this matter. Everyone agreed that the state financing a media crew for this trip should not have occured.



Posted on 15/07/03 3:16:21 PM

Author:
Doctah

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Moose & Squirell,
That's just not the way journalism is done! If the media is truly to uphold the principals of the fourth estate, it must maintain complete independence from who it covers, *particularly* a government agency. Producing a puff piece for an agency it's supposed to keep an impartial eye on does not serve the good of the community-- quite the opposite. If we can't get a view of our goverment free of any potential influence-- perceived or real-- then we're all in much worse shape.
This is particularly true in Hawaii, where cronyism reigns and relationships cloud just about every facet of the state and local government.

Posted on 16/07/03 11:50:33 PM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Doctah wrote:
Moose & Squirell,

That's just not the way journalism is done! If the media is truly to uphold the principals of the fourth estate, it must maintain complete independence from who it covers, *particularly* a government agency.

( a "news junket" and "investigative reporting" are two different things)

...Producing a puff piece for an agency...

(I guess you DO KNOW the difference!)

...it's supposed to keep an impartial eye on, does not serve the good of the community-- quite the opposite.

If we can't get a view of our goverment free of any potential influence-- perceived or real-- then we're all in much worse shape...

(KITV is still going to report the same story regardless of who pays the bill, correct?!)

...This is particularly true in Hawaii, where cronyism reigns and relationships cloud just about every facet of the state and local government.

(Leave the Democrats out of this, please!)

Moose&Squirell



Posted on 19/07/03 5:18:56 PM

Author:
Makiki Boy

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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You know your points would be respectable and read
by everyone if you chose to leave out the unecessary
"Dum Dems" personal political commentary.

I thought we buried the nasty political comments
on the old message board, but I still see it being
brought up. Arent you guys happy or satisfied
yet you have the Governorship, the Presidency
and both Houses of Congress. Yet you still find
ways to complain or be nasty.

There's not much Aloha in your post at all.

And I must say when the Dem's were in power
the Republican's used any opportunity to strike at
the Governor. So your just showing to me if
the slippah fits on the other foot, you wear it!
Unfortunately you guys wear it out with your
snide commentary.

Makiki Boy (A Liberal Democrat and Proud to be one)

Posted on 21/07/03 02:12:18 AM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Makiki Boy wrote:

...There's not much Aloha in your post at all...

Makiki Boy (A Liberal Democrat and Proud to be one)


....There is not much in your post about the Japan trip!

Leo Pa'a Kemokalaka

Posted on 21/07/03 1:33:38 PM

Author:
Makiki Boy

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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What is so un-Aloha about saying I am a Liberal
Democrat and proud of it? Unless of course your
again being sarcastic and the mere mention of a person
admitting they are a proud to be a Liberal
Democrat is being "Dum" or obscene. I never called you or
your party "Dum", and its spelled "Dumb" by
the way.

The reason there isnt anything I have
to say about the Japan trip is because your
obvious slanted political side commentary of
a few choice words you chose to make got
my attention more than the entire meaning
of your post.

Makiki Boy

Posted on 21/07/03 3:23:49 PM

Author:
LeftOfCenter

Subject:
Was KITV's canned Lingle speech also a great idea?

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You remember, the half-hour in which she inveighed against the Dem vetoes for twenty minutes, followed by ten minutes of softball questions worthy of a Bush press conference?

Only one station carried this staged event as "news". It was -- surprise! -- KITV, only about a week before the flap over the Japan trip emerged. One does have to wonder whether KITV has gotten too close to the administration to cover it objectively.

What gives? Is this their new format: "All Lingle, All the Time"? Then again, it was KHON, not KITV, that treated (?) us to "A Day in the Life of Gov. Lingle" a few weeks ago.

I don't recall having seen Ben Cayetano every time I turned on my TV. What's next? "Gov. Lingle Orders the Fried Mahi Plate with Extra Tartar Sauce at L&L Drive-In"?!

(burp),
<------
LoC

Posted on 22/07/03 12:21:07 PM

Author:
Doctah

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Moose & Squirrel (the correct spelling, by the way),
You didn't at all respond to my post, other than make a silly "Let's Leave the Democrats out of this, Please," comment.

That's not all the point of why KITV was wrong. It has nothing to do with political beliefs-- it would be just as wrong if it was a Democratic administration KITV was working with. You miss the entire point, and it's disappointing that you don't have a problem with the blurring of lines between journalism and government.

Let's push this a little more extreme: What if Jeremy Harris enlisted KHON to promote a new child welfare plan we wanted to launch?
Can't argue with that, right? Who's against child welfare?
But what if, turns out, the program is flawed? What if it isn't the best idea after all? How can you trust KHON to give you the straight scoop if they helped Harris out? Even if they were fully upright and reporting it completely without bias toward Harris, wouldn't you have some doubt lingering in the back of your head? Damage would have been done. KHON's credibility has been compromised.

Now back to the real world. What if this visitors program had some flaws in it? Would KITV be the place you turned to get the full scoop? Or wouldn't you feel a little uneasy watching KITV cover something they were involved with?

This is journalism 101. Stuff they teach you your freshman year in college. It's a no-brainer. Once journalists get involved with politics, the integrity of the Fourth Estate has been compromised. I'm shocked you don't see that.

Posted on 23/07/03 09:04:10 AM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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At 11:21:07 AM 22/07/03, Doctah wrote:
Moose & Squirrel...

...Let's push this a little more extreme: What if Jeremy Harris enlisted KHON to promote a new child welfare plan we wanted to launch?
Can't argue with that, right? Who's against child welfare?

....I am!

Posted on 23/07/03 09:40:35 AM

Author:
mel

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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While my political beliefs skew mainly toward conservatism, I appreciate all the comments in this thread as long as we keep it focused mainly on the subject of a media outlet being paid for by a government agency to cover that agency. Thanks for keeping this subject within the confines of the subject matter without going overboard on party politics, left or right.

Posted on 28/07/03 2:07:18 PM

Author:
Doctah

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Thanks, Mel.
Again, Moose & Squirrel's last post didn't address the journalism ethics question at all. M&S, you completely miss the point. My example had nothing to do with child welfare. It's the idea that a station may conduct any sort of relationship with an agency or organization it covers.
Don't get caught up in the politics of it all. It's unfortunate that in this age of talk radio and declining political discourse, we have to resort to shallow "Who's better? Liberals or Conservatives?" arguments.



Posted on 29/07/03 11:15:36 AM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Aloha (..."There is no Aloha in your post") Doctah!, (...Doctor, the correct spelling BTW)


...Again, Moose & Squirrel's last post didn't address the journalism ethics question at all. M&S, you completely miss the point...

(Actually I did address it. You see liberals have a way of arguing about things using loaded questions. Example: Question: Have you stopped beating your wife yet?! You answer No...that means you have beat her before and are still beating her. If you answer, Yes...you still are guilty of beating her in the first place. Even though you have never beat your wife in the first place!)


...My example had nothing to do with child welfare...

( ...Read Carefully...."Let's push this a little more extreme: What if Jeremy Harris enlisted KHON to promote a new child welfare plan we wanted to launch?...(here it comes.)...
Can't argue with that, right? Who's against child welfare?...(Ta-Da)... But what if, turns out, the program is flawed? What if it isn't the best idea after all...")

...It's the idea that a station MAY conduct any sort of relationship with an agency or organization it covers...
(The word "MAY" is defined as "Used to indicate a measure of liklihood or possibility. The use of this word in your sentence indicates a paranoia on your behalf. No Aloha whatsoever. Just fear with no substance. I believe KITV and the Governor had nothing but the best intentions in there decisions.)


...Don't get caught up in the politics of it all. It's unfortunate that in this age of talk radio and declining political discourse, we have to resort to shallow "Who's better? Liberals or Conservatives?" arguments....

(Political Oxymoron Statement #2,765,334...This is how you sound to me!)


Posted on 29/07/03 4:08:32 PM

Author:
Doctah

Subject:
Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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>Aloha (..."There is no Aloha in your post") >Doctah!, (...Doctor, the correct spelling BTW)

Check your facts. Makiki Boy said the "No Aloha in your post" crack.


>...Again, Moose & Squirrel's last post didn't >address the journalism ethics question at all. >M&S, you completely miss the point...

>(Actually I did address it. You see liberals have a >way of arguing about things using loaded >questions. Example: Question: Have you stopped >beating your wife yet?! You answer No...that >means you have beat her before and are still >beating her. If you answer, Yes...you still are >guilty of beating her in the first place. Even >though you have never beat your wife in the first >place!)

What are you rambling on about? The topic of the post, and of this thread, is journalism ethics. The kind they teach you in j-school. KITV violated them, just as the New York Times recently had an embarrassing ethics breach with Jayson Blair, and just as NBC News continues to walk a fine line when it covers certain industries, due to its GE pedigree. That's the topic here.

>...My example had nothing to do with child >welfare...
>( ...Read Carefully...."Let's push this a little more >extreme: What if Jeremy Harris enlisted KHON to >promote a new child welfare plan we wanted to >launch?...(here it comes.)...
>Can't argue with that, right? Who's against child >welfare?...(Ta-Da)... But what if, turns out, the >program is flawed? What if it isn't the best idea >after all...")

That's a little thing we in the business like to call an "example." If you notice, this thread isn't about child welfare. It's about journalism ethics. Bringing up a hypothetical situation about KHON, Jeremy Harris and child welfare was only to make a point about strange bedfellows. The example could have been about anything. Have you even been reading these posts?

>...It's the idea that a station MAY conduct any >sort of relationship with an agency or >organization it covers...
>(The word "MAY" is defined as "Used to indicate >a measure of liklihood or possibility. The use of >this word in your sentence indicates a paranoia >on your behalf. No Aloha whatsoever. Just fear >with no substance. I believe KITV and the >Governor had nothing but the best intentions in >there decisions.)

Again, the very idea that a news station might be collaborating with someone it covers hurts that news organization's credibility. You wouldn't want to see a news anchor stumping for their favorite political candidate, would you? Or doing ads for a proposition on the next ballot, would you?


>...Don't get caught up in the politics of it all. It's >unfortunate that in this age of talk radio and >declining political discourse, we have to resort to >shallow "Who's better? Liberals or >Conservatives?" arguments....
>
>(Political Oxymoron Statement #2,765,334...This >is how you sound to me!)

Again, you make no sense here. Problem is, you haven't even stopped to think about why KITV made this mistake, and why other news organizations such as the Star-Bulletin and professional groups like the SPJ were concerned. Can we stick to the topic, please?

Posted on 29/07/03 4:27:16 PM

Author:
Doctah

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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P.S.
1) sorry about the screwed up margins. It didn't look that way when I typed this up.

2) "Doctah" is a fun, pidginized way of saying "Doctor."

Posted on 29/07/03 6:36:19 PM

Author:
mel

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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(OT - must be a bug in the system regarding the margin quotes)....

Folks, try to stay focused here. Thanx!



Author:
Moose&Squirell

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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At 5:36:19 PM 29/07/03, mel wrote:

...try to stay focused here. Thanx!


Doctah...Listen to Mel!

Posted on 30/07/03 2:30:18 PM

Author:
Doctah

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Hmm, no rebuttal, Moose & Squirrel?

Posted on 30/07/03 11:02:44 PM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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At 1:30:18 PM 30/07/03, Doctah wrote:
Hmm, no rebuttal, Moose & Squirrel?


Read last Post...Again!


Posted on 31/07/03 10:29:51 AM

Author:
Doctah

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"Listen to Mel"? That's your rebuttal?
And why do you spell "Squirrel" correctly in other forums, but not here?

Posted on 02/08/03 10:50:36 PM

Author:
Moose&Squirell

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Re: KITV Japan Trip a Great Idea!

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Doctah wrote:

...why do you spell "Squirrel" correctly in other forums, but not here?


...I believe its time to move on!